Vauxhall Customer Services are useless !

**Ste** · 4th December 2009, 11:49

I have had the misfortune to contact this shower of 'wastes of space' for 3 separate reasons. They have offered ZERO help on each of these 3 issues.

My ONLY conclusion is that they are not fit for purpose.

They are effectively stealing useful oxygen from the atmosphere which other people could use.

I could not have a lower opinion of them if I tried.

In the latest issue I have asked for INFORMATION, a list of possible faults and the relationship between cam and crank sensor timing. Information that will aid ME diagnose a problem with MY car (P0340).

They are unable to give me this information as they say it may cause a mis-diagnosis to compromise repair of my car. I am BAFFLED how this is actually possible. How can INFORMATION on certain aspects CAUSE a mis-diagnosis? Surely INFORMATION aids a diagnosis to be made.

They are morons of the highest order. Maybe I should report them to 'Advertising Standard Authority' for claiming it is 'customer services'.

Below is the full email exchange, for anyone who is interested. Note that they even get the month wrong for the first few emails. It was all Nov.

STE

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Hello,

This is my third Vauxhall, and overall I am very impressed with all of them.

However, I have now developed a problem with my Vectra - 2004, 1.8 engine (Z18XE), LS.

The problem has a fault code (DTC) of P0340 - Camshaft Position Sensor Circuit Malfunction.

I have looked at the wiring and have electrical continuity between sensor and engine controller main engine plug terminals. I have even fitted a new camshaft sensor (part number 90536064).
Unfortunately, this has not solved the problem.
We are travelling and so cannot get to a Vauxhall / Opel dealer !
Would it be possible for you to speak with your technical people and obtain for me a fault diagnosis tree or a list of possible problems that can set this particular fault code, so I can troubleshoot and solve this problem which is severely limiting my cars performance and fuel economy? I would like to resolve this one and only problem as soon as possible.
Other than this, the car is driving like a dream (as usual) and I continue to be impressed with it's reliability - as do my fellow travellers.

Please help !

Thanks and very kind regards,

Steve - A generally very satisfied Vectra - C owner / driver

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Dear Sir

Thank you for your email dated 24 August 2009, regarding your Vauxhall Vectra.

I was sorry to learn of the problems that you have recently experienced with regard to your vehicle and can appreciate your reasons for contacting us.

I can confirm that I have been in contact with our Technical Department with regard to the fault code: P0340 stored in your vehicle.

I was advised that this fault code suggests that the problem could be connected to either the ECU, the wiring, the actual sensor or the timing belt tension. However, we are unable to advise further without your vehicle being inspected by a Vauxall or Opel dealership.

If you have any further concerns or queries please do not hesitate to contact me and I will be happy to assist you.

Once again I thank you for contacting us with your problem and for allowing me to comment.

Yours sincerely

Sarah Haigh
Customer Care Manager

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Thanks for your reply.

As noted in my previous email, inspection by a Vauxhall dealer is not possible due to my current location.

"the problem could be connected to either the ECU, the wiring, the actual sensor or the timing belt tension" - is this a comprehensive and complete list of all the reasons that this particular fault code could be flagged? Are there any other possible causes to this code being triggered?
As I have the ability to log the outputs of both crankshaft and camshaft position sensors simultaneously, can your technical people also advise me of the relation between either rising or falling edges of the camshaft signal to the 'missing teeth' position on the crankshaft.

Thanks and regards
Steve

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Dear Sir

Thank you for your email dated 25 August 2009, regarding your Vauxhall Vectra.

I can appreciate that you are unable to get to a Vauxhall or Opel dealership, however, we are unable to provide any further technical advise with regard to the fault code showing on your vehicle due to company policy.

I can only apologise on behalf of Vauxhall that we were unable to assist you with your query on this occasion.

Once again I thank you for contacting us with your problem and for allowing me to comment.

Yours sincerely

Sarah Haigh

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Hello sarah,

Thank you for not actually providing any help whatsoever. Is that your company policy - ie NOT helping customers? Did you actually speak to someone who actually knows the answer to my questions, or not?

The information I requested was not of a propriatry nature, and could easily be determined - if I had the time and tools with me to dismantle the engine and measure the relationship between cam timing and crank timing.

I really, honestly cannot see why you are taking the position you are taking. What specific company policy prevents you from helping me with easily available information about a car that you have designed, manufactured and sold?

Frankly, I am extremely disappointed with your response. You have totally failed to even satisfy me. I thought that you would have worked hard to delight me, clearly I was wrong.

I realise that GM Europe are in dire straits. if this is the way that you treat customers, I am not at all surprised and really fear for the future of the brand.

How can Vauxhall remain a viable contender for my next car purchase?

Steve

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Dear Sir

Thank you for your further email dated 25 August 2009, regarding your Vauxhall Vectra.

I can confirm that I duly note your dissatisfaction with my previous response to yourself and can understand your reasons for writing again.

I must advise that the reason we are unable to provide you further technical information as we have not been able to view the vehicle and therefore may advise you of incorrect information, which may damage your vehicle further.

Again, I can only apologise for not being able to assist you with your query on this occasion.

Once again I thank you for contacting us with your problem and for allowing me to comment.

Yours sincerely

Sarah Haigh

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Thank you for your response to my email noting my total dissatisfaction with the level of help (ie Non) that you have been able to give me.

Unfortunately, I fail to see how giving me the information I requested could possibly, in any way, cause damage to my vehicle or anything else. Would you care to enlighten me on how knowing the timing relationship between camshaft and crank shaft sensors could cause damage? Or how a fault tree or list of specific errors that could flag the fault code P0340 could result in further damage? My opinion is that you either don't understand what I am asking (which is understandable if you are not from a technical background), or are not communicating very well with the people who will understand what is being asked. Is it possible for me to speak directly with someone who can help me with the requested information, instead of going through a non technical screening?

I have had the misfortune to contact Vauxhall Customer Services on 2 previous occasions, prior to this particular issue. On ALL 3 occasions Vauxhall Customer Services has been unable to offer any help of any kind.

My only conclusion is that Vauxhall Customer Services is unfit for purpose.

Please pass on my comments, especially the last one to your senior management for their consideration and possible intervention or response.

Steve

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Dear Sir

Re; Vauxhall Vectra.

Thank you for your email dated 26 November 2009 (Woohoo, back to the Julian calendar now!), addressed to our Customer Care Department and copied to Mr C W Parfitt, Chairman and Managing Director, who has asked that I respond on his behalf.

We were both sorry to learn of your continued dissatisfaction regarding your technical enquiry.

As advised previously, we are unable to provide techncial information over the phone or by email due the possibility of mis-diagnosis, which may compromise
your vehicles' repair. This is why the retailer network is in place, for such matters. Whilst I appreciate that you are not local to a Vauxhall/Opel dealer at this time, any technical advice
can only be sought from them. Contact details can be found at www.Vauxhall.co.uk or www.Opel.com.

I am very sorry we are unable to assist further on this occassion.

Yours sincerely

Debbie Roberts
Executive Support Manager

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Hi Debbie, and thanks for your completely pointless and non helpful email. I will copy my last email to Vauxhall Customer Services, as you clearly didn't understand what I am actually after. I am NOT after a diagnosis, I am after INFORMATION so that I can perform my own diagnosis - since it is IMPOSSIBLE for me to get to any dealer any time soon.

I would be astounded if the dealer knows more of the technical points of the vehicle than the manufacturers and developers. I am a practicing Professional Engineer too. As you have dismissed my request on the grounds that a mis-diagnosis is possible (in my opinion IMPOSSIBLE, since information cannot diagnose) can you please enlighten me as to how this is a reasonable response?

Here is my last email I sent, with the pieces of information highlighted.

Thank you for your response to my email noting my total dissatisfaction with the level of help (ie Non) that you have been able to give me.

Unfortunately, I fail to see how giving me the information I requested could possibly, in any way, cause damage to my vehicle or anything else. Would you care to enlighten me on how knowing the

timing relationship between camshaft and crank shaft sensors

could cause damage? Or how a

fault tree or list of specific errors that could flag the fault code P0340

could result in further damage? My opinion is that you either don't understand what I am asking (which is understandable if you are not from a technical background), or are not communicating very well with the people who will understand what is being asked. Is it possible for me to speak directly with someone who can help me with the requested information, instead of going through a non technical screening?

I have had the misfortune to contact Vauxhall Customer Services on 2 previous occasions, prior to this particular issue. On ALL 3 occasions Vauxhall Customer Services has been unable to offer any help of any kind.

My only conclusion is that Vauxhall Customer Services is unfit for purpose.

Please pass on my comments, especially the last one to your senior management for their consideration and possible intervention or response.

Steve

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Dear Sir

I appreciate your frustration regarding the technical information you require.

As previously stated, we are unable to offer this via the phone or by email. Whilst I understand that you are engineer, there still remains the possibility of mis-diagnosis.

I am sorry we have not been able to help you and I must advise our position will remain unchanged.

Yours faithfully

Debbie Roberts
Executive Support Manager

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Well thank you for your honesty, ie recognition of the fact that you cannot help me. Neither can the dealer (as I rang my usual local dealer on Friday afternoon to enquire for the information requested).

So, the real situation is that Vauxhall CANNOT help me, even with information in which to make my own diagnosis.

Vauxhall CANNOT help me with information about a vehicle that has been designed, validated, manufactured and supplied by them.

What does that say about Vauxhall?

And by the way, you still haven't explained how information on fault tree or timing can result in mis-diagnosis. This statement really does baffle me. Information is only that.

Well the only thing left to do is say thanks for nothing and don't expect any brand loyalty from me in future. However, please DO expect me to summarise my dealings with you in any format or media, both oral and written, real and virtual. The first place that I will document the whole sorry incident will be on the many internet blogs, forums, chatrooms and any other such places that appeal to me.
I would imagine that there are plenty of official and psuedo official outlets for me to vent my spleen aswell. Maybe some would actually be more interested in my predicament than you clearly are.

But, you probably don't care about that either, just as you don't care about your (ex)customers. Proved by your woeful response to my perfectly reasonable requests.

I truly hope that someone above customer services has read this, even if it's just to gain an insight into how frustrating contacting Vauxhall / Opel (ex)Customer Services can be.

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No response to date.

**GazVXLINE170** · 4th December 2009, 11:59

Absolutely useless, the good old standard 'I was sorry' should of been a clue as to what was going to happen.. Trading Standards m8

Gazza4

**yadziyad** · 4th December 2009, 12:04

yep trading standards

**Big Sig** · 4th December 2009, 12:22

They won't tell you incase the information they give you leads to you doing something that kills the car, they would then be liable as you could claim it was their fault. All they will say is take it to a garage.

**bigknill** · 4th December 2009, 12:22

I've also had the misfortune to have dealt with Vauxhall "Customer Services" in the past.

To cut a long story short, I had suffered a number of botched jobs from Vauxhall franchised dealers and contacted "Customer Services" to let them know what was going on and that they should be more careful about checking the standards of the work that is being carried out in their name.

All I got back was an email saying sorry, but if I had had problems with the dealers I should take it up with them. I replied saying that I think they missed the point - i.e. that they should make sure that the dealers weren't ruining the reputation of Vauxhall but got essentially the same email back, "Sorry, but..."

When I worked in the Customer Services industry, we were trained to do our utmost to solve the problems the customers had. If we couldn't do what they wanted or couldn't answer their query for whatever reason, we had to explain it as clearly as possible, either by letter, or more usually over the phone. Not always easy or comfortable, but people really appreciated it.

Clearly Vauxhall don't need satisfied customers.

**Ste** · 4th December 2009, 12:23

All I want is the specific info about my car, something that they know. How I use that info to determine failure mode is surely not their responsibility?

It has really frustrated me, and how they seem to dismiss you as an annoyance.

Well, I copied it to all the top people too. OK, they may not see it as it will be screened by PA, but it gives ME a bit of satisfaction that certain names are on it.

IE
rick.wagoner@gm.com,
bill.parfitt@gm.com,
Nick.Reilly@gm.com,
Duncan.Aldred@gm.com,
Erika.Caspari-Loewe@de.opel.com,
Heike.Amatruda@de.opel.com

**Penfold101** · 4th December 2009, 12:24

Originally Posted by Big Sig

They won't tell you incase the information they give you leads to you doing something that kills the car, they would then be liable as you could claim it was their fault. All they will say is take it to a garage.

Agreed. You could be any Tom Dick or harry, regardless of what you tell them you are. You could be trying to fault diagnose using Wikipedia for all they know. plus, they're losing out financially by giving you the information you need becuase you wouldn't be taking it to a garage to have the FD and/or work done. Not how a business runs I'd imagine...

**Ste** · 4th December 2009, 12:39

I could agree with you if I was asking for how to do something. BUT I am only after a FULL list of possible causes and a crank angle between crank sensor missing teeth and cam sensor voltage change positions. (eg cam signal change needs to be between 40 and 50 degrees of crank missing teeth to ensure correct syncronisation)

Hardly 'dangerous' info.

**dennis_signum** · 4th December 2009, 12:39

To be honest I wouldn't expect any manufacturer to provide you with technical information such as what you are requesting. You say your a professional engineer would you supply detailed engineering infomration to a client whom wants to do there own fault diagnosis without knowing their level of expertise? After all they could mis-interpret the information and make matters worse.
I would suggest have a 'friendly' chat with your local dealer and see what they can do, IMO you wont get anywhere with your request for information.

**Ste** · 4th December 2009, 12:43

Dennis, firstly see my post above yours.. The other point is, if what you is true about information sharing, then if they just said that, then I could accept it. However, they have not said that and are fluffing and giving out BS. That is one of my points. I don't like BS, tell me straight - that's OK, just don't BS me.