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Thread: Hmmmmm gear box torque!!!!

  1. #1
    Regular Member mikie's Avatar
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    Default Hmmmmm gear box torque!!!!

    I've been reading waht people have said about the M40 Gearboxes, and they say it can hand up 295lbft (Approx) before possible clutch slip....

    So how are those of you running DTUK Red boxes managing considering your running at 343lbtf???


    I've still got my DTUK CRD2 tuning box for sale if you want it. Will take it from 150 - 200bhp and increase your MPG

    Very good bits of kit

    Dyno of the box on my 1.9CDTi Astra (same engine obviously) 343 lb/ft torque


    That was taking from a mate on VXRonline, I drive a Corsa VXR too.

    thnaks

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    The 'F' 40 gearbox is rated at 400Nm (295 lb.ft.) of torque capacity.It will go over that,but for how long and at what expense to itself and other components.

    If you also look at the specs for your VXR you will see that standard engine torque matches gearbox torque rating,just as the torquiest Vectra (V6 CDTI) matches its gearbox rating.You then have to ask yourself: Why is that?

    No one is saying that they can't go over that,but some are saying what are the consequences of doing so.

    By the way.The torque reading does seem a little high for a 1.9 diesel developing 186bhp! And that torque peak is definitely a clutch/gearbox killer!
    Last edited by diesel dog; 6th January 2009 at 20:59.

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    The Astra 1.9 diesel is also fitted with the same M32 (320Nm) gearbox as the VXR I believe and in the above graphs appears to be running well above that through most of the rev range! That's asking for trouble in anyones book!
    Last edited by diesel dog; 6th January 2009 at 21:20.

  4. #4
    Regular Member mikie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by diesel dog View Post
    If you also look at the specs for your VXR you will see that standard engine torque matches gearbox torque rating,just as the torquiest Vectra (V6 CDTI) matches its gearbox rating.You then have to ask yourself: Why is that?
    And so why is that?

    many vxr owners are tuning there vxrs above that limit! Especially TMS,

    With there own limited edtions VXR-S & VXR-R

    heres the spec on the VXR-R

    CHASSIS.

    • TMS Race Suspension, with Uprated Springs and Dampers, 40mm Lower.
    • TMS Uprated Fast Road Geometry Setup
    • TMS Competition Limited Slip Differential

    ENGINE & DRIVETRAIN.

    • TMS Race Exhaust by Milltek Sport with unique black tipped exhaust tailpipe.
    • TMS Performance Front Mounted Intercooler
    • TMS Stage 3 Engine Remap

    BRAKES.

    • 4 Piston Racing Brake Kit
    • Uprated Brake Pads Front & Rear

    WHEELS & TYRES.

    • TMS 18” Lightweight Alloy Wheels by Team Dynamics with Unique Green Lip
    • Dunlop SportMaxx Ultra Performance Tyres

    BODYWORK.

    • Unique VXR-R Detailing & Badges
    • Limited Edition Plaque & Ownership Certificate

    PERFORMANCE.

    • 0-60mph: 4.9 Seconds
    • Top Speed: 170 MPH
    • Max. BHP: 300 BHP
    • Max. Torque: 340 ft/lbs
    as you can see, way over the limit. they are still holding.

    Do they set this limit over a sustained limit over a period of time?

    it reallly confuses me?

  5. #5
    Full Member Big Sig's Avatar
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    It means its designed to last the life time of the car at 295lbs. Go over that and you reduce its life. Is that any clearer?

    Also why do they say its got an uprated lsd in the chassis? Thats engine and gear box. maybe they uprate the bearings in there too???
    Now I need a turbo to keep up!

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikie View Post
    And so why is that?
    These days,because of ECUs,car manufacturers can take their gearboxes much nearer to 'peak' torque conditions because they can 'fix' any problem areas by limiting torque for individual gears (many cars,particularly diesels both manual and auto have first and second gear limited for torque,sometimes all of them!) simply by comparing engine speed with road speed.They don't do this just to show us that they can.

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    Regular Member nutron's Avatar
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    Vehicle : Vauxhall

    Trim : very

    Engine : Z19DTH

    Year : Nosey

    Default

    In my experiance, the 1.9CDTI in the Vectra will start experiancing clutch slip at around 330lbft+. The 3ltr has the same gearbox but a diffrent clutch, the most my clutch ever held was 403lbft and that kicked out 235bhp at the road wheel (around 270bhp at the fly). That's way more that the gearbox is certified for by it's maker but doesn't mean it will instantly fail. The Astra 1.9CDTI as said is only rated to 320NM which is less than a standard 1.9CDTI Vectra puts out. So I would be quite wary of over tuning that box.

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    Regular Member Hideous's Avatar
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    Vehicle : Insignia

    Trim : SRi Nav

    Engine : CDTI158

    Year : 2012

    Default

    Basically, go up to 400 Nm and you know the gearbox will be 100% ok. No problems at all. Totally safe tuning up to 400 Nm as far as the box is concerned as it's fitted to factory cars up to 400 Nm anyway.
    Go much over 400 Nm, and your going into the unknown. Some may fare better than others. Who knows.
    If you are running 500 Nm +, I'd guess that you'd be fortunate to get six figure mileage out of the box.

  9. #9
    Regular Member nutron's Avatar
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    Vehicle : Vauxhall

    Trim : very

    Engine : Z19DTH

    Year : Nosey

    Default

    I've already replaced the engine due to experimantation. You can get alot more out of the 1.9CDTI than you can the Astra. Not only does the Astra have a weaker gearbox, the car is speed limited. The Vectra 1.9CDTI will no go over 135mph on the clock with cruise control alone but if you put your foot down a tuned one will keep going. The Astra has the advantage of better aerodynamics and less weight but the 1.9CDTI Astra isn't as good for tuning.

  10. #10
    spoons
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    Quote Originally Posted by nutron View Post
    I've already replaced the engine due to experimantation.
    lol @ 'experimentation'

    You said you knew what you were doing - lol

    Quote Originally Posted by nutron View Post
    The Astra has the advantage of better aerodynamics...
    Actually, 888 Race Engineering reckons that the Vectra has better aerodynamics than the Astra.


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