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Thread: Any electricians on here?

  1. #1
    Regular Member danlat1415's Avatar
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    Default Any electricians on here?

    I'm trying to install 2 wall light in my house.

    Couple of questions that need answering...

    1) The closest neutral wire is in another room, and don't want to wreck decorating in there too. Is it possible to use the neutral from a plug socket?

    2) Do I need a new permanent live feed going to the switch, or can I jump the live over from another switch in same socket.

    Also when wiring up 2 wall lights, do they need to be in a loop or in-line?
    (connect to wall socket, then lamp1, then lamp2, then back to wall socket) or (connect to wall socket, then lamp1, then lamp2)?

    I've done electrical wiring in an electrical engineering course at college but it was few years back. Just refreshing my memory...


    On another note, it's not good when a light switch buzzes very slightly when you turn a light on.. what can cause this? It wasn't me by the way, it was already like that, but don't like using that switch.



    Thanks
    Dan

  2. #2
    Administrator Big-Pete's Avatar
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    Hi Dan,

    Quote Originally Posted by danlat1415 View Post
    I'm trying to install 2 wall light in my house.

    Couple of questions that need answering...

    1) The closest neutral wire is in another room, and don't want to wreck decorating in there too. Is it possible to use the neutral from a plug socket?

    how come you have live and earth but no neutral, are you taking the feed from a 3 plate light switch? (ie:- live feed, switch wire to existing lights and an earth?)

    Its actually against the wiring regs to "borrow a neutral" from another circuit escpecially so when you are borrowing from power to run lighting, This may also cause you problems with rcd's / rcbo's elcb's etc that keep tripping or it may cause the circuit to not trip out or blow in the event of a fault, neutrals can be the cause of numerous wiring faults. Dont forget to include an earth in the circuit, otherwise it will fail any electrical inspection you may have done in the future.

    2) Do I need a new permanent live feed going to the switch, or can I jump the live over from another switch in same socket.

    Again is it power or lighting..?? (are you taking the feed from a 13A socket or light switch?

    Also when wiring up 2 wall lights, do they need to be in a loop or in-line?
    (connect to wall socket, then lamp1, then lamp2, then back to wall socket) or (connect to wall socket, then lamp1, then lamp2)?

    there is no need to wire them as a ring circuit, they would only need to be wired as you say "in line" (radial circuit) Wall lights should be fed from lighting circuits, If you are taking the feeds from wall sockets (13A power sockets) then they wil need to be fused down via a switched fused spur with 3A or 5A fuses.

    I've done electrical wiring in an electrical engineering course at college but it was few years back. Just refreshing my memory...


    On another note, it's not good when a light switch buzzes very slightly when you turn a light on.. what can cause this? It wasn't me by the way, it was already like that, but don't like using that switch.

    A buzzing light switch will normally be loose terminations or it could indicate wear on the contacts, isolate the circuit and re-tighten them all, if its a dimmer switch and it buzzes its more than likely just the loading, but it may also indiacate that it needs replacing aswell.

    Thanks
    Dan
    Hi Dan, I hope i've helped a bit, if you need anymore info let me know, Im an NICEIC Qualified supervisor for a very large testing & inspection company, im a fully qualified approved electrician & I've been doing electrical inspections only for the past 15 years.

    Also you may need to notify your local council planning office, different councils have different policies / criteria that they require notification about.


    http://www.partp.co.uk/consumer/consumer_diy.asp

    http://www.niceicgroup.com/householder
    Last edited by Big-Pete; 11th August 2007 at 22:12.

  3. #3
    Regular Member danlat1415's Avatar
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    Thanks for your reply.

    The wall lights I'm putting in, I'm going to wire up the the mains circuit, and to a 5amp fused switch. It'll be easier.


    How it currently is:
    I have a wall switch (lighting switch) that has: earth, live, and switched live. No neutral. I can't take the neutral from the ceiling rose as I'd have to redecorate again. I don't have access to the junction box or ceiling void, so I was wondering if you could take the neutral from another circuit (mains) but looks like a NO.
    The buzzing light switch is a 2gang switch not dimmer. I'll check the connections next time power is off.
    I know cheap dimmer switches buzz as I've had experience with these.

    Thanks
    for your help, I think it'll be a lot simpilar if I wire up the wall lights to a mains circuit plug socket, and run a 5amp wall switch. Then I don't need to find a lighting circuit neutral.
    I was wondering about the lights being in a loop, or 'in-line' because would the voltage be shared between them if 'in-line' and causing the lights to be dimmer compared to when wired in a loop.

    Thanks

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    Administrator Big-Pete's Avatar
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    Dan, If you are going to run the feed from a socket via a plug top and not a fused spur then may i suggest you put a 3A fuse in it (if a fault were to occur it would blow the plugtop fuse before causing any damage to the 5A switch contacts and / or the switch user and also prevent the lighting circuit in that area also blowing )
    TBH its not the way i would do it but if as you say you want to avoid having to redecorate due to chasing out walls and replastering then you are left with very little choice other than maybe using conduit or trunking, and that's not everybody's cuppa tea when run surface .!!

    You only really need to wire power circuits in rings, the load from a couple of wall lights is not enough to worry about any volt drop causing you problems, well unless they are very far apart...
    Big-pete
    Last edited by Big-Pete; 12th August 2007 at 01:16.

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    Regular Member SRIFlyer's Avatar
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    Hello DanLat, I am sorry to hi jack your thread but I was about to post to ask for an electricians opinion!! BigPete seems to be quite knowledgeable on it, so I hope no one minds.
    Basically I was putting up some lights in the bathroom and when I took the old light off, I have a pair of red wires, a pair of black wires and a single black wire? I don't know what they are as the wiring on the new light just says, Live, Neutral and Earth. Which one is which? I connected it up earlier and the light came on, but I couldn't turn the ****** off?????
    Not exactly an expert but thought I would have a go and now the wife is mad because I have naffed the new house up!!! Whoops!
    Any help would be appreciated. thanks, Chris

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    Regular Member graham a's Avatar
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    looks to me your two blacks are neutral,and your single black is the switch live.the two reds need to be left together in a connector(not connected to anything)

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    Regular Member dazzer t's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by graham a View Post
    looks to me your two blacks are neutral,and your single black is the switch live.the two reds need to be left together in a connector(not connected to anything)
    just as he says mate, the single black should have a red sleeve or red tape on it to show that is the switch wire, but some electricians tend to double the end over as well.

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    Administrator Big-Pete's Avatar
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    Hi Chris, As mentioned in above replies, Basically connect the single black (which may have a red ID) to the brown on the new light fitting, the 2 black (neutrals) to the blue on the new light fitting and put the 2 reds into a connector block and tape it up, dont touch the 2 reds unless you have isolated that lighting circuit at the fuseboard as these are always live regardless of light switch position unless isolated, and dont forget the earth connection unless its a plastic light fitting, then just put the green / yellow into a connector block

    Big-Pete

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    Quote Originally Posted by SRIFlyer View Post
    Hello DanLat, I am sorry to hi jack your thread but I was about to post to ask for an electricians opinion!! BigPete seems to be quite knowledgeable on it, so I hope no one minds.
    Basically I was putting up some lights in the bathroom and when I took the old light off, I have a pair of red wires, a pair of black wires and a single black wire? I don't know what they are as the wiring on the new light just says, Live, Neutral and Earth. Which one is which? I connected it up earlier and the light came on, but I couldn't turn the ****** off?????
    Not exactly an expert but thought I would have a go and now the wife is mad because I have naffed the new house up!!! Whoops!
    Any help would be appreciated. thanks, Chris
    The most common question / fault in a sparky's life !!

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    Regular Member videodoctor's Avatar
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    Part 'p' of the building regulations forbid anyone not fully qualified to undertake any electrical work other than minor ones eg change a socket over.

    These regulations were introduced to protect people and your general lack of electrical theory proves that your not qualified to do your wall lights and it would be an offense to do so.

    You need to employ someone who knows what their doing,preferably a member of the NICEIC or similar.

    Sorry to sound harsh but electricity is lethal and shouldn't be touched by anyone who doesn't know what their doing.

    And yes i am an NICEIC approved electrician.

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