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Thread: Reliable Rolling Roads in the south west?

  1. #1
    Regular Member matthewp1633's Avatar
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    Vehicle : vectra

    Trim : 150bhp

    Engine : 19dth

    Year : 2008

    Default Reliable Rolling Roads in the south west?

    Can anyone recommend a reliable Rolling Road in the south west area. I currently have a DTUK tuning box fitted to my 1.9 cdti 150 mainly because a friend gave it to me.

    However I would like to get a base line power figure as I plan on getting a FMIC then a hybrid and then get a tea pot map and then get another RR session.

  2. #2
    Regular Member nutron's Avatar
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    They all give different figures so just goto the same one before and after. There is no real point in using a dyno for anything but bragging rights because they don't simulate on the road performance and can mask potentially destructive mapping.

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    Regular Member northpole's Avatar
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    Vehicle : Vectra C

    Trim : SXI limited edition

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    apart from that it is best to speak to Teapot about the Hybrid turbo and FMIC you want to buy because bigger isn't always better so get well known working parts that he recommends... and i would consider bigger injector nozzles, as there is no point in having a hybrid turbo capable of 350 bhp yet, your injectors and fuel-pump aren't able to supply enough fuel for that amount of BHP, than there is your clutch, DMF, gearbox, and engine they need to be in tip-top shape and matched to handle the extra torque that comes with the power hike.

    So talk to Teapot, listen to what he recommends and start your collection of parts from there. And when you put everything on drive ever so carefully to Teapot so he can write you a proper map that takes advantage of all the new hardware properly, because the tuningbox will not provide for those changes, nor will the standard map that your car has. I'm quite sure he can sent you a safe map that you can flash to the ecu, after the changes of the hardware, so you can drive the car down without to much of a problem
    Last edited by northpole; 11th January 2019 at 10:32.

  4. #4
    Regular Member matthewp1633's Avatar
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    Vehicle : vectra

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    Quote Originally Posted by nutron View Post
    They all give different figures so just goto the same one before and after. There is no real point in using a dyno for anything but bragging rights because they don't simulate on the road performance and can mask potentially destructive mapping.
    Ok fair enough I didn t realize RR could be that far out from each other, I just assumed some are good and others maybe not. I am not interested in bragging rights to be fair just reliable power. I have obtained a price for a GT17/56 for £500 and I have been told that it is good for up to 250 bhp which is plenty enough for what I am looking for. I have been warned about pump and injector limits etc and I am aware of the Alfa JTD 2.4 route ref the pump etc.

    I have seen the normal front mount size fitted by most on the forum and I like the look of the 180x300x65 but I will check on that as don t want to dissipate pressure or cause lag.

  5. #5
    Midlands - Head case Organiser Dog_Book's Avatar
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    Vehicle : Vectra Estate

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    Quote Originally Posted by matthewp1633 View Post
    Ok fair enough I didn t realize RR could be that far out from each other, I just assumed some are good and others maybe not. I am not interested in bragging rights to be fair just reliable power. I have obtained a price for a GT17/56 for £500 and I have been told that it is good for up to 250 bhp which is plenty enough for what I am looking for. I have been warned about pump and injector limits etc and I am aware of the Alfa JTD 2.4 route ref the pump etc.

    I have seen the normal front mount size fitted by most on the forum and I like the look of the 180x300x65 but I will check on that as don t want to dissipate pressure or cause lag.
    You could try the rr we went to 2 years ago can’t remember the name the printouts are in my diary it was just near the Dartmouth tunnel and the cafe over the road is brilliant. I don’t do FB but have you seen the drivel K&D post? Standard z19dth putting out 215 bhp and 450nm I think it was total crap. Ironically enough one of ‘us’ with a teapot mapped car had a test drive recently of one with a so called pulls like a train K&D one and it was like night and day the later was very poor. I think a certain someone has been asked to fix the maps from a certain place a few times now and the owners now enjoy their cars.

    Id have to disagree with Karl about RR’s as with the right euipment you can see how the engine is fueling and you don’t want to go lean on a petrol do you. Although my main experience tuning on a RR was a carb fed big single petrol
    Vectra VXR estate 2007 Sapphire Black
    Teapot Tuned 245/300
    Eibachs B8's, fully loaded factory options

    https://www.vectra-c.com/forum/calendar.php

  6. #6
    Regular Member matthewp1633's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dog_Book View Post
    You could try the rr we went to 2 years ago can’t remember the name the printouts are in my diary it was just near the Dartmouth tunnel and the cafe over the road is brilliant. I don’t do FB but have you seen the drivel K&D post? Standard z19dth putting out 215 bhp and 450nm I think it was total crap. Ironically enough one of ‘us’ with a teapot mapped car had a test drive recently of one with a so called pulls like a train K&D one and it was like night and day the later was very poor. I think a certain someone has been asked to fix the maps from a certain place a few times now and the owners now enjoy their cars.

    Id have to disagree with Karl about RR’s as with the right euipment you can see how the engine is fueling and you don’t want to go lean on a petrol do you. Although my main experience tuning on a RR was a carb fed big single petrol
    My experience with RR is from years ago dialing in valve timing on a pinto engined escort and balancing the carbs etc but things have moved on since those days lol

  7. #7
    Regular Member nutron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dog_Book View Post
    You could try the rr we went to 2 years ago can’t remember the name the printouts are in my diary it was just near the Dartmouth tunnel and the cafe over the road is brilliant. I don’t do FB but have you seen the drivel K&D post? Standard z19dth putting out 215 bhp and 450nm I think it was total crap. Ironically enough one of ‘us’ with a teapot mapped car had a test drive recently of one with a so called pulls like a train K&D one and it was like night and day the later was very poor. I think a certain someone has been asked to fix the maps from a certain place a few times now and the owners now enjoy their cars.

    Id have to disagree with Karl about RR’s as with the right euipment you can see how the engine is fueling and you don’t want to go lean on a petrol do you. Although my main experience tuning on a RR was a carb fed big single petrol
    Firstly this is a diesel and so that comment is meaningless and secondly, all the fuelling can be read on the road from the sensors through OBD2 on petrol and diesel from about 2002 onwards. So the dyno has no purpose for tuning other than bragging rights because it does not represent road response or performance and hides things like turbo spiking.

    Any turbo you buy must have the compressor inducer and exducer specified, the turbo remanufacturer has no idea what a turbo is capable of in terms of power but they should be able to state a maximum pressure ration and flow because they compressor flow maps for standard compressors are freely available. Don't buy anything without knowing the inducer and exducer size of the compressor and don't get a turbine trim.

  8. #8
    Regular Member matthewp1633's Avatar
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    Turbo Dynamics have suggested a GT17/56 and they believe with the supporting MAP it should be good for nearly 250bhp?

  9. #9
    Regular Member nutron's Avatar
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    That's a worthless statement from them as a standard car with that turbo can not reach that figure. Don't use them would be my advice. I always use TDI Turbos and you want a GT1756 hybrid with a 41.6/56.0 compressor (an extended tip billet wheel is best but cost more), step gap turbine seal and no cutback on the turbine. The only other choice worth looking at is the number of blades in the compressor, 11 or 6/6 are the norm and they have different benefits:

    11 blades spool sooner in the rev range but not faster, there in no change in lag between the 6/6 and 11. The 11 blade will give about the same torque as the 6/6 usually but less power in most cases because the inducer starts to work the air too much and chokes up.

    6/6 will be a litte higher in the rpm range to spool but again, no more lag (commonly missunderstood and misused term), it has more flow potential and higher pressure ratio potential thus a higher power figure and in some case more torque but usually just more power (dependant on fuelling too).

    I use the half blade options for better flow but for normal driving and everyday performance, some do prefer the 11 blade quite reasonably. I also had some custom wheels made with different characteristics:

    41.0/58.0 with extended tips in 6/6 - spools very well and I pushed it to failure at 38psi, so it will happily hold 29psi (2 bar) all day every day)

    43.5/60.0 with extended tips in 8 blade - spools around 2000rpm and will hold 35 psi (2.4 bar), never had a failure of these yet.

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    Regular Member matthewp1633's Avatar
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    Thanks Nutron some very interesting reading and I guess its a case of what gains/loses suit me best. The 41.0/58.0 spools earlier than standard but runs out of puff at higher rpm? I have contacted TDI turbos and I hope to have some more info shortly.

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