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Thread: EGR explained - all you wanted to know and more

  1. #1
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    Default EGR explained - all you wanted to know and more

    There seems to be some confusion on how EGR works, what effects it has on the engine, what effects removing it will have on the engine, etc.

    This is a comprehensive peer-reviewed published research document. The 'peer review' means that a group of people involved in this subject have reviewed the paper as scientifically sound

    http://www.ias.ac.in/sadhana/Pdf2004Jun/Pe1131.pdf

    It covers the effects of EGR on EGT - which there is concern about Re: EGR removal.

    Now, if you bothered to read the document instead of counting sheep and stayed awake you will notice that the engine is of very low specific power output, so EGTs observed will be significantly lower than those achieved in a 1.9 150

    What would be great is to set up a rolling road, Tech2 / opcom (to measure live EGT) and run a car through a series of power outputs with the EGR operating and again with it blanked.

    If any one has access to this, or if there are any remappers reading this, it would be a great experiment to run so we can get an exact handle on the quantitative effect of EGR removal on EGT in a highly tuned diesel engine.

    Much better than "watch the EGT" or "the EGT will go up"... How much? How does it compare to full load EGT? How does it compare to EGT achieved during DPF regen?

    You will then be able to make an informed choice as to whether you feel EGR removal will place engine components under excessive thermal stress... or not

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    Regular Member nutron's Avatar
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    The EGR does not operate under full load on the 1.9CDTI, so during peak power/temperature periods it would have no effect, regardless of what the effect might be. Thus a tuned 1.9 would still see no difference in peak cylinder temps with or without the EGR.

    Also, my car never had a DPF, so the smoke emissions on mine would be much higher with the EGR running.
    Last edited by nutron; 28th August 2011 at 09:03.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nutron View Post
    The EGR does not operate under full load on the 1.9CDTI, so during peak power/temperature periods it would have no effect, regardless of what the effect might be. Thus a tuned 1.9 would still see no difference in peak cylinder temps with or without the EGR.
    if you were getting a remap, would you blank it off or not? im getting one soon and wondered your opinion? seems like in your post above that the EGR on a 1.9 cdti may as well not be there as its not really doing anything?
    Last edited by Mads; 28th August 2011 at 09:03.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hebblemarine View Post
    There seems to be some confusion on how EGR works, what effects it has on the engine, what effects removing it will have on the engine, etc.

    This is a comprehensive peer-reviewed published research document. The 'peer review' means that a group of people involved in this subject have reviewed the paper as scientifically sound

    http://www.ias.ac.in/sadhana/Pdf2004Jun/Pe1131.pdf

    It covers the effects of EGR on EGT - which there is concern about Re: EGR removal.

    Now, if you bothered to read the document instead of counting sheep and stayed awake
    Yeah. I posted that document once.

    One line in particular stands out, doesn't it?

    "It is seen that the exhaust gas temperatures reduce drastically by employing EGR"

    Peer reviewed, you say?

    Whatever the EGTs, lower is better than higher when it comes to reliability. It normally being that we drive our cars around at part throttle*, rather than at full load or throttle* when the EGR valve is shut. I think that you would be surprised just how rarely the EGR valve is fully closed under normal driving conditions.

    And, of course, EGR is used to reduce NOx emissions.

    *throttle, as in accelerator pedal movement
    Last edited by diesel dog; 28th August 2011 at 10:06.

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    I would also have thought that anyone interested in keeping the inlet air as cool as possible would also be interested in keeping the turbo as cool as possible?

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    Quote Originally Posted by diesel dog View Post
    I would also have thought that anyone interested in keeping the inlet air as cool as possible would also be interested in keeping the turbo as cool as possible?
    The EGR doesn't exactly keep the inlet charge cool, the air goes through the intercooler and then gets hot exhaust gases added to them, not to mention the soot and oil particles, thats not good for power production or engine life!

    Which is the hotter, EGTs at part or full throttle? If the part throttle was hotter then yes I'd be saying that the EGR may extend your turbo's life but I'm pretty certain that full throttle EGTs are hotter and strangely enough the EGR is closed. How's that improve the life of the turbo?

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    He didn't say the EGR keeps intake air cool?

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    True, the point I was trying to make was the effect EGR have on inlet charge tempuratures and the effect on power production.
    If the shaft bearings will take the heat of the EGTs when the engine is on full song then they should be ok with the EGR blanked or removed.
    Are those points not valid?

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    I said it has no bearing on the peak performance of a vehicle in the second post.

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    The EGR valve - on speaking to a remapper - said blank it as it increases engine wear by increasing acidity levels in the engine. Also the EGR valve only has real effect at idle too where there is more air to fuel.

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